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QAMR "Lemon Squeezers"

PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 10:48 am
by Steve_Butler
Image

Can we identify anyone else in this picture of riflemen from the 2nd Wellington Mounted Rifles?

Sergeant (later Lieutenant) David Paterson kneels front left. David's name is referred to on military records either as Paterson or Patterson within various sources. David's heroism at Wadi Es Sir is recorded in the "Official History of the Wellington Mounted Rifles":
...Major Sommerville, with others, had been wounded in the Wadi, and lay on
the ground, exposed to the fire of the enemy around him, and a gallant act was
performed by Lieutenant Patterson, who lost his own life in endeavouring to rescue
him.

Re: QAMR "Lemon Squeezers"

PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 8:47 pm
by greg
Steve,

With regards to the updates page http://www.nzmr.org/updates.htm and the information on Second Lieutenant David Paterson.

34th Reinforcements Mounted Rifles Brigade is not listed in the Lists page see http://www.nzmr.org/lists/reinforce.html .

Either the list is wrong or Paterson was in the 35th and 36th MR(276) :?: :? Any ideas :?:

Re: QAMR "Lemon Squeezers"

PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:37 pm
by Steve_Butler
I don't know what is wrong with your browser but you may have to "Refresh" the page as the 34th's are there - however I loaded them last and it may well be you are only looking at an old cache file - try again:

Reference the 34th on the http://www.nzmr.org/lists/reinforce.html
page- they are there listed aginst the sailing of the Tofua "98" - Lieutenant Ricketts - departed 13/11/1917 arrived Suez 21/12/1917 - Interestingly Greg you were the person that kindly compiled this page (and the others of the men on that sailing) a few months back :roll: :D

The list of the 34th's are also available by going to:
http://www.nzmr.org/lists.htm
click on the link fourth from the bottom - it is harder to see as the line has the Mounted Fiels Ambulance also included and it dosen't read in line with the others departing that day on the Tofua.

definately on the actual page linked to the "Lists" is the name Lieutenant Paterson.
http://www.nzmr.org/lists/34th_reinforc ... lance.html

Re: QAMR "Lemon Squeezers"

PostPosted: Fri Jun 12, 2009 9:31 am
by Steve_Butler
Peter - Thanks for your continued input reference on Lieutenant Paterson.
I have started a topic heading to cover any aspects that we are able to uncover on this man on our FORUM, please go to:
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=527

you will only be able to comment on this site if you register - and we ask that if you do want to register that you do so through your New Zealand provider and not from a Gmail or Yahoo type account - unfortunately these providers are used by hackers and can cause the site problems.

You ask what info I have on David - the answer is very little at this stage and it is just a continual sifting of material.

You can download free a copy of the "Official history of the WMR" from our books section - here by using the PDF search option you can see that Lieutenant Paterson is listed three times - all relating to the one incident were he lost his life.
His papers are availble to be viewed at the government archives in Wellington if you are able to visit.
Thanks for the illumination art work - I will post a compressed version on the forum page including this email to you so that members can keep up their interest in David's history as it unfolds.
regards
Steve Butler

Image
This beautifully etched "Illumination" was sent in by Peter yesterday - just a fantastic piece of art work that showed the appreciation of the surrounding district of Tarata towards their "favourite son". This is a must view, use the close up option to view some of the hand work of Mcleod and Slade Ltd of New Plymouth. I have converted the rather large original file to a compressed PDF file - it is available to view at a very friendly 293kbs size at:
http://www.nzmr.org/pdf/paterson_illum.pdf

Re: QAMR "Lemon Squeezers"

PostPosted: Fri Jun 12, 2009 6:39 pm
by greg
Steve,

The point I am tryin to make is that you have made it sound like the 34th Reforncement NZEF is a Mounted reinforncement which is stated on the updates page, 34th Reinforcements Mounted Rifles Brigade, BUT the 34th Reinforcement NZEF in the Lists Page, it is NOT the 34th Reinforcements Mounted Rifles Brigade. IN other words the way I read it is that he left with the Main Body as Mounted Rifles, but as Infantry as the 34th. Is this correct?? :?

PS could we have a larger image for the poster? :wink:

Re: QAMR "Lemon Squeezers"

PostPosted: Fri Jun 12, 2009 7:28 pm
by Steve_Butler
Greg - No that is not correct.

With regards the confusion with the 34th NZEF departure and the 34th NZMR departure that includes Lieutenant Paterson you need to come up TWO rows of the departure list.
To explain further about the entries on http://www.nzmr.org/lists/reinforce.html page:

The 34th NZEF departure is written as:
"Ulimaroa" - sailing number 100, with the "LInk" as the ships magazine. departed 8th feb 1918.

For the 34th Reinforcements Mounted Rifles you need to look UP the list two entries, there you see the difference as written:
"Tofua" - sailing number 98, with the "Horse Marines" as the ships magazine (the magazine you kindly typed out the passenger lists for me) - departed earlier 13th November 1917.

Now if you go to the actual 34th NZMR page at:
http://www.nzmr.org/lists/34th_reinforc ... lance.html

you will see printed out the 34th Reinforcements NZMR and the reinforcements NZMR Field Ambulance passenger list for that departure on the Tofua - on the first column of three - under the heading 34th MR you will note the third name: 2nd Lieu. D. Paterson.

I have corrected the link to the PDF file in the post above yours - it should have (and is now corrected to) read :
http://www.nzmr.org/pdf/paterson_illum.pdf

Re: QAMR "Lemon Squeezers"

PostPosted: Fri Jun 12, 2009 7:47 pm
by greg
AH! Got it! Do you think you should colour code the 34th MR as per the other MR reinforcements? :P

Re: QAMR "Lemon Squeezers"

PostPosted: Sun Jun 14, 2009 3:30 pm
by Steve_Butler
It is just by accident that the Mounted Rifles departures are mostly the one shade colour of yellow on the sheet - actually the colours have been placed to seperate the convoy sailings, (or in some cases an individual ship departure date)- Therefore the coloured rows of one shade together denote the number of ships departuring from New Zealand on a particular date as a convoy.
Some rows show only one shading - this denotes a single ship departure and not in convoy - however in all (most) cases these individual sailings joined Australian convoys in Perth or Sydney.
It should be noted that the majority of Sydney destinations meant the NZ troops were transshipped into an Australian Convoy and the NZ ship returned to Wellington and acted again as a Tasman Ferry troopship service.

What I would like to see - Has anybody got copies of the" Auckland Weekly News 1918" - as you will have noted the print out from archives shows that there is a photograph available of David Paterson in one of the issues of that year.

Re: QAMR "Lemon Squeezers"

PostPosted: Sun Jun 14, 2009 6:55 pm
by Tarata
DSCF0462-3.jpg
Uniform issued to David Paterson 11/596
DSCF0463-1.jpg
A Table for the Uniform of the Mounted Rifles
Photos of a Uniform Issue Document and a Size and measurement Scale. The first indicates the number of clothes a trooper might have and the second the types of clothing. I notice that Jackets were sized for up to six ft troopers! The photos are decolourised and cropped to reduce the size for the website

Re: QAMR "Lemon Squeezers"

PostPosted: Mon Jun 15, 2009 10:53 am
by Tarata
Steve
Yes we have a copy of the Auckland Weekly News with David Paterson's Photo. This came in the box of memorabilia. However the page has been torn across the lower half of the photo and a piece of 'selotape' used to repair it, which has turned yellow. I will scan this and post it, but hopefully someone has a better copy. We do not have a photo of David alone, my wife Chris (David's neice) remembers a framed photo on the wall, but this has dissapeared. A photo was sent to Mrs J Sommerville, the mother of the Major Sommerville who died in the same engagement as David, so I am hoping to find another photo in the future.
Peter

Re: QAMR "Lemon Squeezers"

PostPosted: Mon Jun 15, 2009 11:13 pm
by Steve_Butler
Good research Peter - Look forward to developments.
Where exactly is Tarata?
Taranaki - but where - what is the closest town?

Re: QAMR "Lemon Squeezers"

PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 11:04 am
by Tarata
Steve
Tarata is about 10 Km East of Inglewood, passing through Kaimata. It is on the banks of the Waitara River, where a road bridge crosses. The tar sealed road carries on either to Purangi or round towards the coast joining the coast road just north of Waitara (through a short tunnel). The area was settled, with Government stimulus, after the Land Wars, about 1880-1890. David Paterson's father took up land, for milking cows, but the first cows died of Tutu poisoning. The family farm (470 or so acres) is about half the size of the ANZAC area at Gallipoli.
Peter

Re: QAMR "Lemon Squeezers"

PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2009 10:16 pm
by Tarata
Are the Bandoliers in this photo the 1916 model, please? What is the significance of sergeant's stripes on both sleaves?
Peter

Re: QAMR "Lemon Squeezers"

PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 5:47 pm
by Steve_Butler
Peter
Sorry I didn't follow up on this thread - I thought one of the "Uniform" boys would add something - because frankly I don't know why some men wore stripes on both arms and others did not.

However if you go to:
http://www.nzmr.org/kit.htm

the top photograph on the page readily shows the difference between the two Bandolier styles - the types worn in the photo at the top of the page are obviously the "Type 1" introduced by the Otagos way back in 1905 and worn at Gallipoli.

Re: QAMR "Lemon Squeezers"

PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2009 11:43 am
by atillathenunns
Hi Steve,

Going by the hats, I believe the photograph was taken at Awapuni Race course at Palmerston, and was most likely taken on the 24th August 1914 or just after this date.

A quick search shows David Paterson at this stage was with “A” Squadron, Wellington Mounted Rifles Regiment. It is my guess the other men in the photo are most likely “A” Squadron men.

“A” Squadron = S.S.M. H. J. Dunham, S.Q.M.S. R. Bell.
Sergeants - D. McDonald, W. Richetts, W. E C. Morgan, D. Paterson, H. PyeSmith, K. Howie, C. J. Pierce, E. H. Allison.
Farrier -Sergeant Hawke.

“A” Squadron also had a Corporal G, Paterson.

It may be possible to cross reference the names of “A” Squadron members with the 1915 Roll of Honour book to help narrow down and identify the other men in the photograph.

Brent